Airsoft Turret

[Krylzay]

I finally got around to finding some info on an industrial fan that could easily push someone back.

Here is some info I found
http://www.multi-wing.net/windtunnel/tech_wind_techdescr.htm
http://www.smjfans.com/prod/prod01c.htm


Now I know this fan is quite big but it has the power to push a human weighing 300 pounds backwards. Pushing the scrawny CS characters backwards could be done at a smaller scale with some ease.

[FluffyKitty.deadm]

Again, the physics.
- The fan + motor are going to weigh some where around 1/2 ton.
- It will require a 220v high current generator weighing a few hundred pounds.
- A platform solid enough to hold the fan, say 100 pounds.
- Some type of mounting system to hold it to the ground. Remember Newton's third law, "For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction". Meaning as hard as it it trying to push against a player, it is trying just as hard to push itself away from the player.

So a player is going to carry 1500+ pounds of fan while fighting to deploy it in hopes someone comes close enough to it so it can blow them to the ground?

[Krylzay]

The fan I linked two is close to those measurements however I am suggesting using a design like that but on a much smaller scale. If scaled down say by 10, it would weigh closer to 150. I am sure this is close to the Mini gun weighs.

As for Newtons third law I think you aren't thinking of it correctly. The fan would be pushing itself back because of the airs resistance to moving but not because its pushing a player back. In that case due to Newtons 3rd law, it would be the air that is pushed back after hitting a player.

[FluffyKitty.deadm]

You drop the scale you drop the force, didn't we already discuss this?? To get the forces requires you need a big fan with a heavy high horsepower engine to drive it. You should of noticed in your search the fans capable of exerting the forces required are huge. There are no mini-light weight fans capable of exerting the forces required. That is the fundamental flaw in the whole concept, the physics do not allow it to happen, pointed out MANY posts ago.

As for Newton. In order for the fan to push a player it has to exert a force. It does that not matter if a player is there or not. "For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction" means as long as the fan is running it is exerting that force. Because it is exerting a force in one direction a force is created in the opposite direction trying to push it away, hence the need for a mechanism to fix it to the ground. Without it the fan would push itself across the ground, the way:

- A jet engine pushes a plane through the air.
- A propeller pushes a plane through the air.
- An air boat's propeller pushes the boat across the water.
- A helicopter's rotor pulls it through the air.
- An out board motor pushes a boat through the water.

[Krylzay]

I understand completely that the fan needs to be heavier that the player but this does not mean that the fan will always push itself back hard enough to knock it over when it is left without a holding mechanism. The fan needs to push a player backwards and nothing else so it does not need to have enough force to knock itself over.

As for the "fundamental flaw" in the concept, I explained that the fans I linked two are capable of pushing hundreds of pounds backwards. The CS charaters cant weigh much more than 200 pounds. Reducing by times 10 was an example. It would be just as easy to reduce by times 5. Close to 200 pounds of gear to carry (which in this case could hurt the player like drowning does after 10 seconds or so due to the weight) and would have the power to push someone 200 pounds backwards. We could easily say any type of special armor would make the player too heavy to be lifted into the air, and would only be pushed back a minor amount. In the end the flaw is more of a constriction than a flaw.

On that note, what about the current turret? I am sure a gun like this would weigh over 150 pounds why is this in question when that gun is clear to pass.

I know we have been at this for a while but I myself don't mind coming online to make a quick post trying to combat your argument. I understand if you do.

[terrorizorpwns]

this is kinda pointless just pushing them not damaging

[FluffyKitty.deadm]

If a high power light weight fan that can generate the forces required to push a person around at a distance exists, post it. If a light weight motor powerful enough to drive it exists, post it. If a light weight power source to run it exists, post it.

this is kinda pointless just pushing them not damaging

Yeah agreed, but a whole other conversation there.

Added:
Not that it matters, but the, "General Electric XM214 Minigun" weighs 27 pounds. The full system with 1000 rounds of ammo weighs 85 pounds. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XM214_minigun . You can argue with a smaller caliber (lighter) bullet, 1/10 the rounds (100 rounds total), and reduced battery pack (enough for 100 rounds instead of 3,000) the weight could easily be 35 pounds or less.

[Krylzay]

The reason I cannot find a fan like that is because people don't make fans to push other people backwards. You cannot argue that when sized reduced there still could be enough power to propel a human.

For the XM214 minigun, maybe a missed something but it left out a laser targeting system. How does it tell ally from enemy.

As for it being pointless because it doesn't damage people, something doesn't need to hurt another person to assist in killing it. This gun would be pushing enemies into the air where it is easy to hit them and hard to get hit by them. It would also require players to start using their two accurate shots in the air wisely.

[FluffyKitty.deadm]

It does not have to be designed to push people, it just needs to generate forces required to push them, and be light weight. They don't exist because of the Physics, as I repeatedly keep saying. There is a direct correlation between the size of the fan, the forces it generates, and its weight (area = Pi times radius squared).
More area = more air = more force = more required horse power = farther the air will travel = heavier device.

If it was possible to make a light weight fan with the characteristics you describe, they would. It would have many uses in aerospace and industry.

In the world today the devices that generates the most thrust to weight ratio's are:
- Rocket engines (would fry some one before it would push them)
- Jet Engines. (They can produce the thrust but are weight prohibiting when they get big enough to push someone over.)
- Industrial fans (Same issue as Jet Engines).

Added:
Laser scanners are quit common, easy to build, and come in many forms.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3D_scanner

Since the CT's and T's have unique silhouettes you would recognize the differences in silhouettes. Neural networks exist to recognize people through pattern recognition and can be trained to recognize different patterns:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facial_recognition_system
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pattern_recognition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prior_knowledge_for_pattern_recognition

Here is a real world example of a robotic sentry gun designed for use on the boarder of South Korea, complete with video:
http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/Science-Fiction-News.asp?NewsNum=762

[Krylzay]

The reason they do not exists it not because they are impossible to make but because it is obviously more expensive to create a smaller fan with the same force as a larger one.

The smaller the fan the more rpm it needs to be equal to the force of a larger fan. The more rpm it needs the more power it needs. While these attributes do make the fan more heavy it does not make it an impossible heavy object. As said I suggest making the weight slowly take away your health if you carry it for so long. This would be more realistic.

[FluffyKitty.deadm]

If that were true, then a jet engine would exist to do the job, as it has the best power to weight ratio and come in MANY sizes, and can turn in excess of 29,000 RPM. All I see from you is opinion. If its possible, find it and post it.

[terrorizorpwns]

This would take more time to set up than is worth while in the time it takes to set it up you could just shoot the target

[Krylzay]

This would take more time to set up than is worth while in the time it takes to set it up you could just shoot the target

Not really... you just slap it down and kills become as easy as walking.

[terrorizorpwns]

yea but in the time you set up the turret you would have been able to kill the enemy and while your setting it up the enemy will shoot at you this desigh is just not praticle

[Krylzay]

yea but in the time you set up the turret you would have been able to kill the enemy and while your setting it up the enemy will shoot at you this desigh is just not praticle

Don't set it up in the center of an open rats map. It really is that simple. This is true with everything as well as the current turret.